On today’s episode of The Art of Paid Traffic we’re continuing our mini-series on using webinars and paid traffic to quickly grow your business.
And on the show today, I’m pumped to welcome my good friend John Lee Dumas from eofire.com.
For those of you who don’t know John, he’s built a multi-million dollar business around his daily podcast eofire. He’s also the founder of Podcaster’s Paradise, a community of about 2,800 (so far) people who are looking to create, grow and monetize their podcast.
John has primarily grown Podcaster’s Paradise through webinars in conjunction with Facebook ads and that’s what we’re going to dive into today with him.
In Today’s Episode, You’ll Learn:
- How webinars have completely transformed his business and the reason he started using them in the first place
- How he uses Facebook ads to drive registrations for his webinars and the simple tweak he made to his ads to increase his live show-up rate
- His top 3 tips for having a highly converting webinar
- And how after doing 1,200 interviews with top entrepreneurs around the world, the #1 strategy he’s discovered and implemented for moving your business forward, and how you can do the same
Transcription Of Today’s EpisodeClick here to view/hide transcription
Rick: All right, John. What’s up my man? Welcome to The Art of Paid Traffic…. I really want to be talking to you about how you’ve used webinars to build your business. I know that’s been a major focal point for you over the past few years, and also I want to get into how you’ve leveraged Facebook ads to drive registrations for those webinars. Let’s start off with how long have you been doing webinars in the business?
John: I’ve been doing webinars now for two and a half years, and I’ve done now over two hundred live webinars.
Rick: Have you really? Is it that number now?
John: Yeah. It is.
Rick: All right. Two and a half years. Two hundred live webinars. Why did you decide to do them in the first place?
John: I was really a fan and an admirer from a far of a number of entrepreneurs like along my journey. Amy Porterfield, Lewis Howes, Derek Halpern. I was seeing these people were doing great webinars. They’re having these workshops where they were bringing on hundreds if not sometimes thousands of people. Delivering great value, great content, great interactions, and they were also making sales on the webinars.
I knew that when I launched Podcaster’s Paradise back in October of 2013 that I was going to have that initial rush of sales, because I had the community waiting for it, but then it was going to definitely flatten out and plateau, and that if I didn’t find a way to continue to get great value, great content in front of people that the sales were not going to keep rolling in.
I knew that needed to be part of my journey and that’s actually why I hired Lewis Howes as a mentor for six months, because he was the webinar king. He wrote the book on the subject, literally, and that was an amazing part of my journey where I learned how to do webinars, created my webinars, and then just started crushing webinars.
Rick: At what point did you start doing them weekly?
John: It was January of 2014. It was like part of my New Year’s resolution. I said, “Okay.” We launched Podcaster’s Paradise October 2013. We had a couple of months of great sales that started to kind of dip off into the end of the year, and I said, “This is going to be the year. 2014 will be the year of the webinar.” I started live webinars weekly that month.
Rick: How often were you doing them before that?
John: I had just done two total before then.
Rick: Okay. I want to dive into that because that’s something that I’m hearing a little bit more. People are taking your lead. They’ve seen the success that you’ve had with the weekly webinar but there’s a lot that goes into that. People can often say… Very similarly, like people told you that you couldn’t do a weekly… I’m sorry, a daily podcast. Doing a weekly live webinar isn’t as easy as some people… It’s obviously very doable, but there’s a lot that goes into it, and you are the master of systems and getting a process down in place so that you can be repeating that. What was that process and system like for you to be able to do a weekly webinar?
John: It was one thing that really hadn’t been done up to that point in the systems that we use, because this was back when Google Hangouts just started to be able to become integrated and embedded on actual websites and web pages. I like found this tutorial that somebody had just come out with that said, “Hey. Look, you can do a Google Hangout. You can grab the embedded code. You can put it on this lead page, got a form or template, and then it will actually be playing live for the world. There is a forty second delay, but I went through that and I studied it and I said, “Man. This is now possible that I can create a system where I have a team.”
It was myself and Kate and a couple of virtual assistants working behind the scenes, but I knew that we just have the team, just the two of us create a system where I could actually launch a Google Hangout, send Kate a Skype of the video embed. She could do what she needed to do on her end with the lead page template, set that up so that we can then just invite people to a URL. For us it’s EOFire.com/podwebinar. Now I just had this URL that I can share on Twitter, on Facebook, and say, “Hey. We’re having a live podcast right now. Come join.”
It’s not like going through that whole annoying launching and downloading process of go to a webinar, and all those other things you need. It was just a URL that was living right there, right then. I saw that system in place, and, again, we refined it time and time again.
Every single time that we did a live webinar, starting in January 2014, Kate was taking notes about things we had to improve upon, and it was really a living and breathing organism that really didn’t get perfected until mid 2014.
Rick: Then how were you driving traffic to that webinar? Obviously you’re starting to mention it during the podcast and on your email list, but how were you … I know you started using Facebook ads to drive traffic to it. At what point did you do that, and what was sort of the decision behind doing that?
John: The first four webinars in January went phenomenally. People were loving them. We had a pretty big email list, and we were driving people from that email list to these live webinars. We also were just like having other people share that, “Hey. We’re doing a live webinar today. If your audience wants to learn some free, valuable content about how to create, grow and monetize a podcast this webinar might be for them. Again, it’s completely free. It’s just a value add. Let them know.” The reality was, is that after about four of those we said, “Hey. People that we’ve reached out to have heard about the webinar, they’ve had an opportunity to go there. We don’t just want to keep beating our email list, and beating it down to a dead horse.”
It was in February of 2014 that we said, “Hey. It’s time to get into Facebook ads.” There’s a massive population out there that if they just knew that we were doing these live webinars they would actually jump on board, and that was such a revelation for us, because we didn’t really know much about Facebook ads. We quickly found people that did, and listened to great shows like this and read great content that you’ve put out, Rick, and that other great people have put out as well and said, “Hey. Like Facebook ads is possible. Like let’s do this.” I actually, I remember I bought your course, FB Advantage, and went through that and that was a huge help.
It was really huge for us to say, “Hey, okay. Now we can actually go out there. We can figure out an audience that we want to target and get people to webinars live.” Again, we perfected that process. We found out that it was much better for us to only have three or four days out from the ads, because that was really getting people to show up to the live webinars because they hadn’t signed up like a week ago or prior. We learned a lot of things during that process, but it was really in February of 2014 that we started going big, and we were spending a thousand to two thousand dollars a week to get people to those live webinars.
The ROI, the return on investment was sometimes ten, fifteen times what we were actually using to drive, plus we were growing our email list from that, so it was like a double win-win, because even if people didn’t show up the specific one they signed up for, we were letting them know about the next one the following week.
Rick: Yeah. I think you bring up a couple of really good points here. Number one, whenever we’re using Facebook ads to drive traffic to a webinar, not only are we getting registrations for the webinar that we’re doing, but we’re also building our email list in the first place along with that, and for those people who maybe don’t attend the webinar they’re at least now on your email list. You’re able to start to build that relationship with them, and maybe they don’t buy from you right away, but they buy from you six months, twelve months down the road. You’re still bringing them onto your email list and into your world, if you will.
You also mentioned a really interesting point there where you guys figured out that when you started your ads about three to four days in advance of the webinar, the live webinar, that was working best for you guys, where that you were seeing the highest show-up rates. Tell me a little bit more about that and how you guys tested that.
John: We started immediately advertising for the next webinar the day after the first webinar when we first started, so we’d have webinars on typically Wednesdays is our webinar day. It’s like webinar Wednesdays. By noon Pacific we’re done that webinar on a Wednesday, and we would typically turn on the Facebook ads for that next Wednesday webinar, and what we were seeing is that we’d be getting X number of people signing up. Like let’s just kind of use simple numbers here. Let’s say we get a thousand people to sign up over that week, we were seeing like a fifteen percent show-up rate on that. Then like a hundred and fifty people would show up live and we’d be like, “Okay. So that’s like fifteen percent. That’s not great, but that’s a lot of people live. That’s good.”
Then we just started testing things. We tried just starting our actual advertising on that next Friday, or maybe we wait until Sunday, so it would be like Sunday, Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, and what we saw was that the percentages of show-ups would go up the closer to the actual webinar we started. If we started on Sunday, we might only get six hundred signups, but then we’d get like still a hundred and fifty show-ups, so it would be like a thirty percent show-up rate. Then we were seeing that, “Hey. We can actually get as many people to show up at a much higher percentage of the sign ups spending a lot less money.”
It was just really us realizing that, “Hey. It’s like the three or four day mark that’s perfect for us.” Anything over three or four days we started seeing diminishing show-up rates.
Rick: Yeah. I think it’s a really really good lesson there that you bring up, is that you’ve got to test this out. You got to test if you are running Facebook ads to drive registrations for your webinar, you got to be testing out when you’re starting those ads to get people to that live event, and figuring out where is the highest show-up rate. Where is the highest show-up rate that you’re seeing, how many days out, and just kind of testing that to see which one works the best for you. What kind of revenue were you bringing in on each week with those live webinars, and would you say that, I think I know the answer to this, but would you say that this was the biggest revenue effect and growth of your business, or the reason for the growth of your business so quickly?
John: Yes. Absolutely. It was the biggest revenue stream for us in 2014, and again, in 2015 it was our biggest revenue stream.
I will absolutely without a doubt say that it was the Facebook ads driving to that, that had the people, number one, showing up that allowed us to build that base to continue to kind of drive that evergreen effect, and to your point that you made earlier, Rick, that I loved, because I’ve gotten emails from people six, twelve months down the road that said, “John. I’ve been to four, five, six live webinars and honestly it just wasn’t the right time for me when I first signed up, but you’ve just built up so much know, like, and trust with this value that you’re giving every single week, and I’m learning something every day, and I’m asking questions on these live webinars, and you’re answering them. Now I’m ready. Now I’m buying.” They were doing just that. It was a huge critical process.
Rick: It was a time where you kind of stopped. Not really stopped, but you sort of paused doing the weekly webinar, during 2015, is that right?
John: Yes. 2015 we decided to take a step back and it’s actually … We did two webinars a month, so we went to every other week. That was just a decision because we had other things going on. We had a lot of other things we were bringing into the fold, like we started a course on webinars, because we were so successful with the webinars, so we created Webinar On Fire, and I was creating other courses. I was doing a lot of traveling and speaking so we just looked at our schedule and said, “Hey. For sure, the best thing to drive the most revenue would be to continue to do a weekly webinar, but for us now, 2014, was the year for the weekly webinar. This is going to be the year for the every other week webinar.” We’ve actually kind of continued that in 2016.
Rick: Okay. Is it working better for you? Obviously there’s a little bit less work for you during the month even though you have it down to a system. How is that going for you? How are you liking that?
John: I’m liking it because it is freeing up my schedule a lot to do other things, which I know we’re going to be talking about in a little bit here, but the one thing that I really do just want to make sure that your listener get is that sales happen on webinars, period. If you don’t remember anything else from what I’m talking about today, remember sales happen on webinars. Guess what? Sales don’t happen as often off of webinars. I know a hundred percent that we make less sales of Podcaster’s Paradise because we’re doing less webinars, but it’s a trade off that at this point I’m willing to make.
I wasn’t willing to make that back in 2014 because that was our year of webinars, so we’re taking a foot a little bit off the pedal with the live webinars. Every other week, so we’re still really making it a priority of our business.
Rick: It’s still very regular. Yeah.
John: Every other week there is an absolute live Podcaster’s Paradise webinar that we’re doing, but we have taken the foot a little bit off the pedal, and guess what? The revenue has pulled back a little bit as well. That is a reality because sales happen on webinars.
Rick: Yeah. I love it. I love it. You’ve done over two hundred live webinars now. Let’s boil it down to the top three. What would you say the top three tips are for getting or having I should say a high converting webinar?
John: Number one, you need to really focus on the law of reciprocity. The law of reciprocity is a huge just innate thing that we have as human beings. It’s just a reality, so I love starting my webinars off with a gift, and with a real gift that actually means something, so I actually gift my book, Podcast Launch, which is the number one ranked book in all of Amazon on podcasting with over five hundred five star reviews with fifteen video tutorials. I gift that book to the live attendees of that webinar. I gift that to them. Immediate, right at the top of the bat.
Number two is the value, and so for a minimum of forty-five minutes I am just absolutely adamant about providing nothing but pure value so that people can walk away from that being like, “I feel like I just got a 401 course type level and level course in podcasting.” They’re just going to walk away, even if they don’t think Podcaster’s Paradise is right for them, they’re going to walk away and say, “Wow. That was a valuable forty-five minutes of pure value.” Again, that could even go into an hour, like between forty-five minutes to an hour of pure value.
Then I’ll kind of cheat with number three and use a three A and three B, because I think three A is really once you get to the point that you’re going to be talking about what the product, service, or community is that you’re selling, that you’re pitching on that webinar, really being able to show them that. Take them inside your actual community, and for me that was actually being able to share my screen and take them inside of Podcaster’s Paradise and say, “Hey. I’ve just given you forty-five minutes of pure value on creating, growing, and monetizing a podcast. Now come check out my home. Come checkout Podcaster’s Paradise. Come find out why twenty-eight hundred people have decided that Podcaster’s Paradise is for them.”
And showing the video tutorials, the actual conversations that are happening right now within the Facebook, showing them the webinars that we’ve done. Showing them this, that, and all the other things that we’ve done within it, and it’s so critical on so many levels to be able to really take them into that, and then that three B part is interact. Actually being able to answer people’s questions live and saying, “Hey, Rick. I just saw you just ask a question right here. I want to answer that question specifically.” Rick asks and then you repeat the question. Then you answer it and you’re just there removing people’s barriers, because people are going to have barriers that if they were just on a sales page they would just leave, because those barriers would be remaining.
You as a webinar host have the opportunity and ability to remove barriers so that people can have a clear path to joining, again, your product, your service, your community.
Rick: I love it. I love it. As I mentioned earlier I want to kind of transition into your project right now that you’ve been working on for a very long time as I know, but I think that one of the things that I most admire about you and what we talked about at the sort of the top of the episode here is that you are able to focus on … Like, when you decide to do one thing, or to do something, that’s all you focus on, and you get a system and process in place so that you’re able to get that down very quickly and take something from, like you said at the beginning of 2014 you decided to do webinars, so then, “All right. I’m going to do a weekly webinar at that point.”
Get the process down, focus solely on that, and get it to a point, and I think I remember you saying that it took you about six months or so to get it down to, really to a point where you were really happy with it, it was converting for you, you got the system down, but you really focused on that, and I know that you go through a series of steps and things to be focusing on in order to get something like that done which, and correct me if I am wrong here, is a big reason why you decided to put together the Freedom Journal. Talk about the Freedom Journal and this project that you have going on right now.
John: I’m a huge believer in focus as you mentioned. It’s really been a mantra of mine for a long time and that’s follow one course until success. I just see so many entrepreneurs fail because they let those weapons of mass distraction just take them down. It’s so sad to see, because we can accomplish really big things if we just focus on that one thing, one step at a time, and so with EOFire I’ve now done over twelve hundred interviews. I’ve interviewed twelve hundred successful and inspiring entrepreneurs, so, Rick, people would come to me all the time and they would say, “John. What’s that one secret to success? Why are your guests successful entrepreneurs?”
Which used to frustrate me a little bit because I would just answer it, “Guys. It’s hard work. Like they’re really hard workers. That’s why they’re successful, so get your butt to work. Start working hard.”
But then taking like another step back I would say, “You know? There is one commonality that all of my guests that are successful entrepreneurs have. They know how to set and accomplish goals while unsuccessful entrepreneurs struggle at this very thing.” I decided, “Hey, it is time for me to create the first physical product for EOFire.” Because I knew that this product had to be physical, it had to be just something that you could hold onto, that was there, that just kind of stared you in the face. Was holding you accountable right there as an actual physical product.
In early January ’15 I started on my journey to create the Freedom Journal. The Freedom Journal is exactly what it sounds like. It is just a journal that will get you closer to your goal of freedom because as entrepreneurs that’s what we’re all looking for. We are looking for freedom in our lives, in our work, in whatever it might be. Freedom to do what we want, what we choose, so the Freedom Journal is just this beautiful, leather bound, gold embossed journal that will teach you how to set and accomplish your number one goal in one hundred days. It’s very specific. You will accomplish your number goal in one hundred days going through the Freedom Journal.
We start by having you set a SMART goal which is specific, measurable, attainable, relevant, time bound, and then we guide you through that process of accomplishing that SMART goal in a hundred days with a very unique step-by-step process. There’s daily tasks, nightly recaps, ten day sprints, quarterly reviews, and resources galore on every single page. I’m really passionate about this. Again, it took me a year to create and to have it actually physically made, shipped over here. Now it’s actually in the warehouses in LA ready to be shipped out to everybody who is backing what we have going on right now, which is the Freedom Journal Kickstarter campaign.
This is a campaign that I’ve created to just really build awareness of the Freedom Journal, and also build awareness of the great organization that we teamed up with and partnered up with which is Pencils of Promise, because I’m looking to really build a legacy with the Freedom Journal in a major way.
I love the fact that every single time that we hit a funding goal with the Freedom Journal, I am actually personally writing a check for twenty-five thousand dollars to build a school in a developing country, so I kind of like to say, “Hey. When you contribute and pledge to the Freedom Journal like you’re giving yourself the gift of setting and accomplishing your number goal in one hundred days, which, by the way, you deserve listeners, but you’re also giving the gift of education to those less fortunate, and that’s what the Freedom Journal is all about, is that awesome legacy, that awesome feeling, that awesome gift to yourself and everything is going on and going down at TheFreedomJournal.com, Rick.
Rick: FreedomJournal.com. Okay. I was just going to ask you where could people find out more about this. I love it. I feel really fortunate and I know that we’ve talked about this in the past. I feel really fortunate to play a very, very small part in just sort of coming up with ideas for helping … You know coming up with a few ideas-
John: Don’t minimize your role. Listeners, every week Rick and myself get together in a Mastermind, and we would talk and the Freedom Journal, whenever it was my turn to talk about what I was going on, the Freedom Journal was my focus, and Rick you are a huge part in the creation …
Rick: I appreciate that.
John: … in the curving and the carving out of the content within the Freedom Journal.
Rick: What I really remember is a year ago, almost a year ago … Eleven months ago right now as we’re recording this, back in February of 2015 we were in Montana for the Mastermind weekend and we were walking in the woods, sounds very romantic, we were walking in the woods, and we were talking about this. That’s what like just to kind of see it come to fruition right now a year later has been awesome. To go through the process and watch that and to where you are right now with it. You had the launch party the other night here in San Diego which was awesome.
I’m excited to start using it myself, and so I think the project is so cool, and all the schools that are going to built from it, even better. So many lives being changed by this project, so very, very cool. TheFreedomJournal.com is where people can go check it out. John, my man, thanks so much for coming on the show. Really appreciate you taking the time to do so.
Sign-Up for A Free Live Podcasting Webinar with John: eofire.com/podwebinar
Check out John’s Freedom Journal: thefreedomjournal.com
Subscribe to The Art of Paid Traffic on iTunes and/or Stitcher
Links & Resources Mentioned in this Episode
I use EasyWebinar for my automated webinars. Check it out: RickMulready.com/EasyWebinar
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