A Masterclass in Storytelling to Make More Sales, with Jude Charles (Part II)

rick mulready

A Masterclass in Storytelling to Make More Sales, with Jude Charles (Part II)

May 27, 2022

In the last episode of The Art of Online Business, I talked with Jude Charles all about using storytelling to stand out in the crowd. 

The online business space is getting pretty crowded these days, so it’s more important than ever to find ways to set yourself apart from the rest. Jude explained the power of using a story in your business and how to pull a story from your memory and use it to drive home a point and separate you from everyone else. 

This week is a continuation of the conversation with Jude. In this episode,  he’s interviewing me and helping me craft a powerful story that I can use in my business. At the end, he will bring it full circle and show you how you can use this method to increase sales and uplevel your business through the art of storytelling. 

For over 15 years, Jude Charles has been producing documentaries for entrepreneurs. He has produced stories for Google, Steve Harvey, and dozens of visionary CEOs.

Jude is the author of Dramatic Demonstration. This book is a roadmap that teaches you how to dig deep to find compelling stories that no one else knows, and then leverage those stories to grow your business. Jude’s mission is to lead and empower entrepreneurs to have relentless, unwavering courage.

In This Episode, You’ll Learn:

  • Jude’s process for helping clients build a story
  • Why I do what I do
  • Why storytelling is so impactful
  • The benefits of having a story bank
  • How you can start creating your story bank
  • How to get better at storytelling

Links & Resources:

*Disclosure: I only recommend products I use and love and all opinions expressed here are my own. This post may contain affiliate links that at no additional cost to you, I may earn a small commission.

Jude Charles’ Links:

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Other Episodes You’ll Enjoy:

Standing Out from the Crowd Through Storytelling, with Jude Charles (Part I)

A Simple (Yet Often Overlooked) Way to Grow Your Email List

6 Lessons I’ve Learned After 600 Episodes



[00:00:01] Speaker1

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[00:01:38] Speaker1

Hey my friend, welcome to the Art of Online Business Podcast. My name is Rick Mullaney and I’m an online business coach. I’m an ad’s expert, and most importantly, I’m a dad. And this show is where we help established online course creators and coaches create more profit, more impact with less hustle. All right, let’s get into it. So coming into this episode, the part two conversation of a conversation I have with Jude. Charles So Jude, last week, if you not yet heard part one of my conversation with Jude that we talked all about standing out from the crowd through storytelling. Now, if you’ve not yet heard that episode, definitely listened to that episode prior to listening to today’s episode because number one, it’s an amazing episode about storytelling. Jude is a filmmaker, he’s an expert storyteller, and we talk about how to use storytelling in your business to be able to grow your business and stand out from the crowd. And today’s episode is part two. I’ll be honest with you. I came into this interview here with Jude a little nervous. 

[00:02:46] Speaker2

Because he. 

[00:02:48] Speaker1

There’s the whole purpose of this particular episode. Part two here is to kind of nicely tear apart a couple of opportunities that I had to tell a better story when in fact I ended up telling explaining how I created a honey cinnamon latte in front of an episode I did with Zach Butler here in the podcast and episode number 594. And it had completely zero relevance here for the episode. And so Jude basically breaks that down, how I could have improved that story. And we also get in to really I basically he basically interviews me and we and then we have a great conversation after he ask me a whole bunch of questions. And I shared things on this episode here today that I’ve never shared on the podcast here. So we go pretty deep on some stories here. Make sure that you listen to the end, because after we tell these big stories that you’re about to hear, Jude raps like takes everything full circle and how you can do to be doing the same thing. What he’s pulling out of me and what you can learn from this. That’s that’s what my goal is for today’s episode. What you can learn from this conversation and put it into practice in your business so that you can up level what you’re doing in your business through the art of storytelling. So yeah, this is a masterclass in storytelling. I’m also thinking about it as Rick gets schooled in storytelling. So without further ado, let’s go hang back out with Jude. Charles. Jude I’m almost a little afraid of part two of our conversation here today. I have a little I don’t know what to I don’t what I’m getting myself into. I’m I’m just going to turn this episode over to you here in just a minute and let you lead the way. 

[00:04:42] Speaker2

So we’ll probably see.

[00:04:44] Speaker1

The show, everybody. Welcome back, Jude, to part two of our conversation here. So you all, if you have not heard the part one of my interview here with Jude, definitely go back and listen to that episode before you listen to this one, because that episode is all about sort of the art of storytelling, if you will. And we really dove into this is what Jude’s expertize is, and we get into how to leverage story in your business, where to find these stories, etc., etc.. And today’s episode will make more sense after listening to that episode, because what we are going to do today, Jude, is going to, shall we say nicely, tear apart a couple of my episodes that I’ve done here in the show and how I could improve the storytelling from the perspective of connecting to the topic of the episode. And I brought up in that episode last week. Where I told this. Painful after listening to it, after I published it. Story like completely dumb story about how I was making. I learned how to make a honey cinnamon latte, coffee drink with my fancy espresso espresso machine here zero zero relevance of the episode. But anyway, dude is going to tear that apart a little bit here today and I’m excited about it. But anyway, let’s have you reintroduce yourself. Jude For people, maybe they listen to last week’s episode, maybe they’re like, Screw it, I don’t want to listen last week. I want to listen to this episode here. Who is you, Charles? And what is your expertize here? 

[00:06:28] Speaker2

Yeah, I. Am a curious human being who loves storytelling. I love to dig deep into other people’s stories. I am a filmmaker. That’s what I do every day. I started the business at 17 years old when my teacher, Mrs. Donna Lee, decided to hand me my first set of business cards. She said, Jude, you’re really, really talented at business. You should start. You really are really talented at video production. You should really, really start a business. And then handed me my first set of business cards the next day. Yeah. And so we had a fun conversation about storytelling and about whether or not you’re strategically using stories. So you I think you are a great storyteller. I will say. 

[00:07:14] Speaker1

That. Thank you. The answer is no, though, too. Am I strategically using them? Let’s get that out of the way right away. 

[00:07:21] Speaker2

Right. Yeah. And I did listen to your conversation with Zach. So I listen to the whole podcast. First of all, it was a great podcast because you asked a really great questions and I almost got lost in Zach’s value that he was giving the the information that he was given, that I forgot that I was. Trying to figure out why you told this story in the beginning. 

[00:07:42] Speaker1

Realize that after we do this interview here, I’m going to go back to my podcast production team and. 

[00:07:47] Speaker2

Delete delete the honey. 

[00:07:50] Speaker1

Cinnamon latte part of that episode. 

[00:07:53] Speaker2

I don’t think you need to delete it. So let’s talk about that because I don’t think you need to delete it. I do think after listening to the full podcast episode, there were ways to tie it in. Oh, really? Yes. So first of all, let’s let’s backtrack for a second. Why did you tell the story? I know you said you don’t remember why, but is this like any relevance to you? 

[00:08:14] Speaker1

Yeah, it’s a good question. Like so number one, I won’t go back and delete it because people who are listening to this episode right now, who have not heard that episode are going to want to hear like this two and a half minute diatribe. That makes no sense. So the reason why I did it is because I hear from a lot of people that they’re like, I want to know more about you, Rick, like behind the scenes, like what makes you you and a lot of people know that, you know, I joke, but yet I’m serious. Like I’m a coffee snob, right? Like, I just just that’s just the way it is. And so I just try to. The reason I told that story was just because. It was fresh in my mind. It happened that morning. I was recording that morning and. I was pretty proud of it. 

[00:09:02] Speaker2

But it was. 

[00:09:03] Speaker1

Solely to share a little bit more about me. And to share with people, you know, all of my listeners here. About what makes one thing that makes me and one thing I really enjoy. Yeah, but again, I listened to it afterwards. And I was like, I was literally listening to it. Now talk about a story. I remember I dropped off my daughter at preschool, pulling out of the parking lot onto the main street. And I’m like, Oh, you know, there’s the episode. Let me just listen to it, which I sometimes do and it get into it. And I was driving, I was like, Oh, this is terrible. 

[00:09:42] Speaker2

Yeah, that’s. 

[00:09:43] Speaker1

Why I did it. 

[00:09:45] Speaker2

So did you actually listen to the whole episode?

[00:09:47] Speaker1

I did not. I just listened to like the intro. And I was like, That’s enough of that one, Rick. 

[00:09:55] Speaker2

Well, I actually like the story, and I think I agree that your audience needs to hear more about you and you about behind the scenes, but also know that your coffee snob and it’s great to share. But you guys actually talked about coffee on the show. I don’t know if you remember it. It was like a small 10/2 mention, but we used to drink coffee. 

[00:10:13] Speaker1

Yeah, he used to drink like eight cups a day or something like that. 

[00:10:17] Speaker2

Right. Right. So that was one way you could slide it in. Hmm. There was another time, though, or a different way this you probably wouldn’t have thought of initially, but that was. I only thought of this because I listened to the whole thing. Zack talked about his journey. You guys mentioned journey a lot on that. And right after you told the coffee story, you said that about like, Zack’s gone through a journey with his business, right? And I think what Zack did or what he talked about really well was the fact that what he does is not for everybody. And he’s very unique in his process in the way that he does things. And you mentioned with making coffee that some people would be disappointed that you’re making coffee, but not drinking black coffee or just regular espresso. Yeah. But you’re just enjoying the journey of making coffee. Learning how to make the honey cinnamon latte coffee at home. So that’s another way that you could have tied it in. Where? It’s a it is an interesting story in your personality comes out but I think tying it to the episode those are two easy ways to tie it to the episode. 

[00:11:24] Speaker1

You’re totally right. And as you’re saying that, what’s coming up for me is and this isn’t an excuse, I think this is a learning experience for everybody listening right now. So I’ve been podcasting now or nine years now. I started in the middle of 2013 with my very, very first podcast called Inside Social Media, completely irrelevant to what what we do today. But where I’m going with this is that I’ve gotten to a point where and this is causing this is a big aha moment that I’m literally having it right now is I tend to look at it like I need to churn out really good episodes and I just do that right or what I feel like are good episodes. 

[00:12:11] Speaker2

But when it was a good episode. So yeah, I agree, I would agree with this. 

[00:12:16] Speaker1

But the, the, the podcast market is so saturated with, I mean, tons and tons and tons of choice and, and stuff that people have. And, you know, I have very, very loyal listeners for listening. Thank you. I super appreciate it. More than you realize, I also this is the way I’m thinking about it right now. Jude is like, I need to value my listeners time even more so and sort of up the game. This is one way I can up the game on the show is to slow down a little bit in the production of the episodes. And I don’t mean like editing and all that 

stuff, I mean putting the episodes together. And one way to do that is, is the stories and really stopping thinking of the stories, being intentional with it, rather than just trying to throw at some random. I made this coffee this morning. 

[00:13:11] Speaker2

What is what is the point of the podcast? The art of online business podcasts? Yeah. 

[00:13:18] Speaker1

The reason I have it. 

[00:13:20] Speaker2

Mm hmm. 

[00:13:20] Speaker1

Yeah. So, I mean, for me, this is a an awareness platform for me in the business. It’s a positioning platform. It’s a value adding platform. I mean, we have at a time recording this next week is going to be our 600th episode here on the show. 

[00:13:41] Speaker2

Which is wow, that’s a lot. Congratulations. 

[00:13:44] Speaker1

Which is. Thank you. Which is like just blows my mind when I think about it. But it’s also to drive business, right? So people who listen, I don’t know the number, but I can honestly say it. I don’t know if I’ve ever shared this on the show, but like. Easily north of 90% of our accelerator coaching applications or applicants are listeners of this show, which which makes a lot of sense to me. So it’s that, you know, we leverage the show in that way to. The other thing I want to do, and this is part of growing up or the podcast growing up, if you will, and my self growing as a business leader is I want to use this platform to elevate and amplify other people because we do get really, really great reach with the show. And so those are all the reasons that I do it.

[00:14:40] Speaker2

How much time are you spending going back to listen to the episodes or because you talk about the idea of going back to spend more time on production? Just the storytelling part. Yeah, with everything you mentioned, the value add, amplifying others, it’s a great lead generation tool. So you said awareness. I’m saying young generation. But is it realistic for you to spend more time? Is it worth you spending more time producing like as you say this out loud and you think about the amount of time that it might take to. Spend more time on storytelling. Is it worth it for you? 

[00:15:17] Speaker1

100%. And here’s another lesson for everybody listening to the reason I can answer that quickly or that that question answers so quickly. Jude, is that. Because of what I just mentioned. Our program is is our accelerator coaching program. North of 90% of the applicants. Listen to this show. So I know that the more successful the podcast is, the more successful the overall business is. And this is something for be listening right now. This is one thing I talk about all you know on the show all the time. Find what works and do more of that. I don’t mean like add a whole bunch of things is like do more of what’s working, improve what’s working. I don’t mean improve it, but like. Really focus on that. And that’s an example of me doing that here with what we’re talking about here. 

[00:16:12] Speaker2

Yeah. And so I wanted to make sure that actually because it will take more time to do storytelling. But I have a core value that I believe in depth versus width in depth versus with. I believe that every interaction I have, every conversation I have, I’m going to go really, really deep in that interaction. The way I run my business, I only take on five clients a year. For that reason, I have a team and they’re amazing. But who I need to be when I show up to work with a client, it can only happen with five production clients a year. The conversations we are having today on the podcast, we go really, really deep, but it takes more time to do that. But it’s worth it to me because the way that I show up in the interactions that I have and the way that I am taking my time to tell certain stories. It makes the relationship that I have that much more important. So you talk about this podcast and you have raving fans and people who have listened for a very long time. Mm hmm. But that’s why it’s important to ask the question, is it worth it? Because it is going to take more. There’s no way of hiding that. Doing storytelling is going to take more time. Yeah. But you got to know that it’s important to do that, even if it takes a little bit longer for an episode to come out that you’re always reminding yourself this is what’s important for the next level of art of online business. 

[00:17:36] Speaker1

That’s it right there. You nailed it. Like, that’s what’s important for this. The next iteration, I guess, if you will, of the show, because I tell people all the time, like, yeah, we’re going to hit, you know, 600 episodes of the show. But I honestly feel like I’m just getting started. I mean, we’ve done been very successful with the show, but even still, like, I have so many things I want to do with it. And a lot of those things I don’t even know yet, but I know that I want to. And this is an a perfect example that you’re bringing up here, Jude, that I want to that I want to focus on and also. I’m so glad you bring that up. Like, it’s kind of like I feel like I owe everybody listening. I owe all of you the depth, that dude that you’re bringing up right now that you’re talking about. 

[00:18:23] Speaker2

Mm hmm. Why do you care? Why is this important that you take it to the next level that you give of yourself, not just to the podcast, but also to the accelerated program? Yeah. Why? 

[00:18:38] Speaker1

Well. As far as taking it to the next level, it’s important to me and I care about it because of the fact that people tune in. People expect this. I publish Wednesday and Friday. If I don’t publish on a day, I hear it from people like, Hey, where’s the episode? Right? And so, number one, I hear from people all the time, like I listened to you on on my dog walk or walking to yoga class or whatever it is. I hear that from people and they’re like, I had the biggest aha! And I had to write it down. Or I went and write and did it in my business and I saw an immediate result and holy cow, thank you. Or I mean, I’ve heard from people. It’s just the impact that I’m able to have, I guess, is that because I do hear from people all the time, like I’ve been following what you’ve been teaching for years and I’ve been able to retire my spouse. You know, I hear that a lot, which I love, but just examples like that of the impact I’m able to have. That’s why I do the podcast, and it’s also why I do what I do in accelerator. But we are able to do that. Talk about depth. We’re able to do that even at a much deeper level because it’s a far, far, far smaller group. Right. It’s only it’s frankly, only a handful of people are right around 35 people total. So it’s it’s the depth of the impact that we’re able to have. 

[00:20:03] Speaker2

You said you got started with the podcast about nine years ago. Was that about the same time you left Corporate World? 

[00:20:09] Speaker1

Yeah, I left September 30th, 2012. 

[00:20:12] Speaker2

And I remember. 

[00:20:13] Speaker1

Well, that was I remember exactly. It was a Friday. It was a Friday. And yeah, it was actually originally going to leave in June. But my boss at the time had asked me to stay through the summer and I was not happy because I really wanted to go. But I looked at it like, hey, it’s I literally remembers thinking this, all right, it’s easy money. And I really don’t have to work very hard for it because I was really good at what I did. And I’m not like tooting my own horn. Like, that’s what I was thinking about. Like, yeah, but then, like, September came and I was like, Oh, some stuff had enough. So anyway, yeah, so that was the, the fall of 2012. And then in my fumbling around, I was like, Oh yeah, I’ll start a podcast. And so, yeah, so that’s when I the middle of 2013 is when I started that show.

[00:21:07] Speaker2

Why was it the right time to leave corporate world in begin on your own to do it wasn’t the art of online business as it is today was you were doing other things. But why was it important for you to be on your own finally and doing entrepreneurship? 

[00:21:24] Speaker1

I was so I had reached a point where I was so tired of doing what I was doing, like I loved the space I was selling online advertising. So I’ve been in online advertising since 2000. Mm. And, but I, I, I became so jaded basically of the space. Because. What what that what the job honestly, what the job really was is to be completely frank and honest. I had to kiss the ass of these, you know, early twenties junior media planners at these agencies just to, like, get, you know, get accounts and stuff like that, get campaigns to for the for the companies that I was working for. I didn’t like the fact that my success and my financial income was tied to however they were feeling that day, or whoever took him out and got him hammered the night before. That’s that’s really what it was. And I know a lot of people are thinking or listening right now, like, yeah, Rick, welcome to the world of the sales. But I just was not that was just I was so tired of it. And then so I was like, I got to get out of here. 

[00:22:41] Speaker2

When did you realize you made the right choice? When did it click? Like, it’s one thing to think you’re going to be another and that this is going to work. When it clicked like this was the right thing for me to do. This is the only thing I that I, Rick, already can be doing in my life. 

[00:22:56] Speaker1

It wasn’t until honestly, until like. Honestly to like 2016. 

[00:23:04] Speaker2


[00:23:05] Speaker1

Because I fumbled around for the first 15 months or so and. I didn’t I mean, again, because I was like, I left corporate and I was like, cool. I’m an online entrepreneur. I had no idea really what that meant. 

[00:23:20] Speaker2

You know, the. 

[00:23:21] Speaker1

Reason I was introduced to it, I can tell you exactly, was that a guy by the name of Adam Baker and Man versus Debt is what his website was. And he talked about how he and his family got out of debt and they used to travel the country and all this other stuff. And so he was making all this money from this website and I’m like, Wait, how is this happening? So he was my very first coach. I paid him 500 bucks a month. So anyway, he is the reason why I started out in Facebook ads. Long story short is it took me even when I started to see success in February 2014, that’s when I started doing webinars and I was like, Holy cow, I can make a lot of money doing this. I still had one foot in, one foot out. It was still like, Ooh, if this doesn’t work, I can go back to corporate. I can go back to selling out online advertising. 

[00:24:13] Speaker2

What was holding you on the line? What was holding you? 

[00:24:16] Speaker1

Fear. It was it was just that fear. You know, I have and I have talked about it quite a bit on the show here over the years is like I really struggle with anxiety and worrying and stuff like that all the way back. I can pin it back to like seventh grade. And that was very, you know, I was burning through savings in 2013 and. Yeah. Like I can tell you exactly what happened. It was probably the fall of 2013. I had savings in the bank, but I was burning through it because I wasn’t I wasn’t successful in any way at that point. And I had met him a few times prior. But I remember Louis Howe has reached out to me and said, Yeah, I’ve just been checking in on you. Why haven’t you? What are you doing? What are you doing? Like, why are you not why isn’t this working for you yet? And he told me, he said, I think it’s because you’ve given yourself too much of a runway. There’s not enough urgency there. And I was like, Oh, that’s interesting. So anyway, then I got a coach and things started. But I still for those first couple of years of success in the online business, I still had one foot in, one foot out because I was waiting for the other shoe to drop. And I was like, I can always go back to corporate. 

[00:25:42] Speaker2

So and so. Now we’re in 2022 as we’re recording this over a decade. You’re in this business. Yeah. So much impact that you’ve created. Why do you do what you do? Why do you wake up every morning doing what you do? What is your why? 

[00:25:58] Speaker1

Are you looking for a story right now? Jude Because I can share a story. 

[00:26:02] Speaker2

Which look exactly what I’m looking for. I’ve taken this long route. Jessica knows what I’m doing. I’ve taken this long route to get really deep into. Here’s why. Because as you make this transition. It is the Y that you hold on to. They in the time that you’re going to take to do more storytelling, it is the why that you hold on to why storytelling is important is because it’s the one thing that no one else can duplicate. No one else.

[00:26:32] Speaker1

From your experience. Because of your experience. Because of your experiences. 

[00:26:36] Speaker2

Because of your experiences. Anyone else talk about being running an online business or being a coach or anything like that, but they can’t duplicate your story. And for as much time as it takes to begin work on storytelling and work on telling your story strategically, not just because we’re all storytellers, every person, every human being is a storyteller, but it’s how you tell that story strategically. What we’re working on right now is I’m getting really deep into your why so that every time you get on the podcast from this point on, in some form or fashion, this Y has shared, in my opinion, your why should always be shared. And so that’s where I’ve kept asking you why or like even going back to your origin, because your origin story is, is part of your why too. And there’s always three stories you can tell your origin story or why story and then how you you’re impacting others. But I really want to get deep into your why because the why is what’s going to drive the next iteration of the art of online business. 

[00:27:38] Speaker1

I think I think I started telling this story in the last episode. I honestly don’t remember, but. I remember being home from college one summer and I was sitting in the living room of the house I grew up in where my mom currently lives. And I remember my dad coming home. So my dad was I think I did talk about this in part one. My dad was an auto mechanic and he used to work at I grew up in New Hampshire, Portsmouth Naval Shipyard, which is border of Maine and New Hampshire. And so he was an auto mechanic on the shipyard. He was a civilian employee. And so I remember him coming home one day and he was in his blue, you know, mechanic clothes, if you will. And he had his igloo, you know, little cooler with, you know, lunch they took for lunch. And he walked in to the house and he was all hunched over and he was walking kind of slow. And I was like, Are you okay? And he said, Yeah, I’m just really sore. And this is a guy who’d been for years and years. He was just leaning over cars and trucks and fixing them. And his hands hurt and his hands were kind of curled up. And it just like, as you can see, like that image stuck with me and I could see how hard my dad was working. And, you know, we just, like so many people write like we grew up with like lack and scarcity mindset. When it came to money, money didn’t grow on trees, we can’t afford that, etc., etc.. And so combine all that, when I got and this was not my why when I first started the business, my one of my why when I first started the business was I want to make as much money as possible. 

[00:29:20] Speaker1

Right? I want to call my own shots. I want to do my own schedule. And none of that has changed. But there is a deeper why. And that’s what what I’m describing is what that is. My why is I want to be number like on a personal level. I want to be the example for Maya, my daughter. She’s right now three and a half years old. I want to be the example for her that you don’t have to work. Yourself to a level of pain in your body, whether it’s emotional or physical, in order to make a lot of money. I want to be that example for her. I want to show her what’s possible there. On the other side of that on a like I don’t want to say less personal but. Outside of my immediate family. I want to show people that that exactly what I’m talking about is possible. I want to help people be that example for their families so that they can be more present with their kids. They can have more time for doing whatever it is that they want to do, that it’s not about the hard work. Equaling money. And I’m not saying don’t don’t work hard. I’m not saying that at all. But there’s more to it. There’s more available to you. And so I want to help people be that example for their families. 

[00:30:44] Speaker2

Have you shared that before? Let’s just going to. 

[00:30:46] Speaker1

Say I’ve never shared it to that level on the show here. 

[00:30:52] Speaker2

The. Clarity in which you speak. I want audience, the audience to pay attention to this, the clarity in which you speak about that. In my opinion, is so, so intense and so meaningful. I mean it the image that you had of your father coming home from work that day is extremely clear from the clothes that he wore, the igloo that he had in his hands, the way his body was positioned, hunched over. Yeah. 

[00:31:23] Speaker1

Extremely clear. And what I didn’t add, actually, now that we’re thinking if I can jump in real quick. My dad passed away of colon cancer when I was 25 and he was sick for ten years, multiple surgeries and all this other stuff. He was sick for ten years. But I truly believe to this day that the stress of his job shortened his life. And I don’t ever want that to happen, you know, for for me, like, I don’t ever want to be that example. Now, I don’t mean like my dad was a poor example. I don’t mean that at all. But I don’t ever want like a stress of a job to affect my health. And again, going back to being an example for for Maya and I want to help people do the same thing. I don’t want them to feel like super stressed and burnt out and where it’s affecting their health. And that was a big piece I left out.

[00:32:18] Speaker2

No, it’s it’s it’s an important piece. I’m glad you included it. But it’s again, it goes back to when you’re thinking about taking this to the next level or the next iteration, that story has to be told over and over like I can I can guarantee you and I want your audience to do this, like listening to this. If you had never heard this story before. Share what this story meant. Share that story with Rick, what this story meant to you. Because honestly, I can relate to it. 2014, I went to Spokane, Washington for leadership conference leadership, as had always been important to me. At that point, it was extremely important and I will never do this again. But I decided to take a bus trip from Spokane, Washington, which is the furthest north Washington state is the furthest Northwest Point. I live in Florida, which is the furthest southeast point of America. And I was just like, I’m going to take a three day bus trip home. I knew it would never happen again, and I thought it would be really cool to say that I’ve done this before. Well, it’s not cool at all because I was miserable. But this. 

[00:33:23] Speaker1

Sequence sounds terrible. 

[00:33:25] Speaker2

Dude. I was miserable. By the second day I had my phone off, but I turned on my phone. By the second day, we had gone to Chicago, Illinois. And as soon as I turned my phone back on, my sister had texted me. She said, Call me back. It’s urgent. Now is this 2014th July 2014 and. At this point in my life. My father was just diagnosed with prostate cancer in March. My mother was suffering from depression and she had in the past tried to commit suicide. So when I got that text, I knew it was either mom or dad. I braced myself. I called my sister and it ended up being dead. They found him unresponsive in the house. I knew what that meant, but they didn’t want to tell me while I was on the road. I got on the first flight back to go back home the next morning, 6 a.m.. My brother came and picked me up. He came with his daughter. My niece and I hugged my brother. We didn’t say a word, but I sat in the back seat of the car with my niece just staring out the window because at this point of my life, I’m 25 years old, I’m the youngest of ten children, and I feel lost. In my niece, Ayana looks over at me and she says, Uncle. Why did Grandpa have to die? And I stared at her and she said it again. Why did Grandpa have to die in that question rang in my ear. 

[00:34:55] Speaker2

We spent about a week preparing funeral plans. But I got my answer throughout that week and at my father’s funeral because my family had leaned on me, youngest of ten, to help them through this process due to What are we doing? How are we doing it? Why are we doing it? And then. At my father’s funeral. Jude, the youngest of ten, the youngest of the family, ends up giving my father’s eulogy. At that point in my life, it had solidified why leadership was important. It was important because in one of the hardest moments of my life where I felt lost. It was up to me to step up. And I did. But it wasn’t until I went through burnout in 2020 that I realized. And just going through like processing everything that had been through. My purpose in life is to lead and empower entrepreneurs to have relentless courage. I always knew the leadership part. I was never clear on the relentless coverage part. But it started with this moment in 2014 with my dad, and that’s why I said I relate to it so much with you, because I was 25, too, when I lost my dad, right? Oh, really? Yeah. And my dad was a construction worker. He worked as a matter of fact, he worked two jobs Monday through Friday as a construction worker. On the weekends, he worked as a private driver seven days a week. He worked? Yeah. I didn’t want that either. 

[00:36:28] Speaker2

I loved my dad. Was he provided and he was he was there. And I’m grateful that I was raised with both parents. But he worked a lot. Yeah. Never at track meets or any of the extracurricular activities that I did. And so that’s what, again, I relate to what you’re talking about a lot. But that’s what there’s so many of us that have that story of our parents. We are the first generation entrepreneurs. Yeah. That our parents weren’t that. And if you share that story over and over, even if it’s at the end of the podcast so that people will understand, hey, you just listen to the hour. We gave you so much value. But I really want you to understand why is why do we do what we do? When you look at standing out in a sea of noise and you look at the podcast market is saturated. Absolutely. Yeah. Especially when it comes to Q&A interviews. Right. But when you. Give that story. That is what helps you stand out. And that’s what brings someone back to say, No, I don’t just want to listen to the art of online business. I have to listen to the auto online business because it’s coming from a different place. Yeah. So when you think about how to strategically tell stories, we talked about this on the last podcast, part one, there’s the story bank that will make it far more easier for you to tell stories. Yeah. 

[00:37:46] Speaker1

Can you just recap what that is for people? 

[00:37:48] Speaker2

Yeah. So I years ago, I don’t even remember when I created it, but years ago I had created a story bank and I just would write down stories because stories happen to us every day. That’s why I say we’re naturally storytellers, right? Like when you get home and someone asks you, how was your day? You go into a story, you go into a moment in time that’s happened. That’s what a story is. A story is about a very specific moment in time. It’s a recounting of a very specific moment in time. And so I write down these stories every day. Every day I’m just or maybe not every day, but sometimes when something is happening, I write down a story. The other backup to that is you could have an album in your phone that is just you’re taking pictures of these moments happening and you’re going back to tell the story of what happened. Well, when you do that, though, especially with your rig or anyone running a team, you can make it easier for yourself because now you just have a library of story. So when you’re going back to produce the episode or to think about How do I tie this to a story so that it sticks? You go back to that story bank because when you deposit a story in your book, the story bank is a book. It’s a journal that I write in every day. When you deposit a story in there, you can withdraw. That’s what I like to call it, a bank. Yeah, but even this coffee story, you are a.

[00:39:01] Speaker2

The other cool part that I love about storytelling, we’ve seen this with Netflix. You can make it into its own little mini series. You learn how to make honey cinnamon latte today, but what if you learn how to make a different coffee? And now it really is a journey of. We understanding we as the audience understanding how much of a coffee snob you are? Yeah, well, at the beginning episodes that way, it’s not just you sharing this story that has no point. It’s you sharing a journey. Now, they’re on this journey with you, right? They’re going through this moment in time with you. But the story bank. You’re writing it down now. Your team has access to that or you have access to it. And when you meet with your team, they’re able to strategically pick, Oh, that will be a great story to go into because maybe if you’re not the one listening to each episode, but it’s your team listening and coming back with notes and saying, Hey, this is what you talk. And it matches this. Yeah. Again, that’s the way to look at storytelling. It’s not just telling the story for the sake of telling the story. I do believe in show your personality share behind the scenes, but it’s it’s more important. How do you share that as a cohesive journey? That’s it. It makes me want to. It makes them want to listen. That makes them want to lean in. Right. The last thing I’ll say about it is I often talk about like people that write, especially content writers or just if you sell a product. 

[00:40:30] Speaker2

You know, the product is important. You know, the life changing effects it has. And you tell people by this, by this, by this, but the person doesn’t know. You have to invite them to care. When you have that product, you want to make meaning of what it is that you sell. You don’t want to just tell them, Hey, buy this because I sell it, make meaning of it. How do you make meaning of it? Bring me to a very specific moment in time. That that shows me this is important. That shows me this is life changing. A very short story that that I often use to share that is a fitness coach who she does fitness coaching online for for women over 40. And she received a picture from her client one day. And the client sent her a picture. Of an empty airplane. And in the text message it says, this is the first time in my life I haven’t had to ask for a seatbelt extension. It tells me a much different story about fitness and weight loss than just lose £30 or to fit in those jeans again. No, this is possibly embarrassment. I no longer have to go through or uncomfortable anxiety that I no longer have to go through. The first time in my life I haven’t had to ask for a seatbelt extension. That’s a different way that you sell fitness than just lose weight. Hmm. 

[00:42:00] Speaker1

And I brought up in the in part one of our conversation here about. 

[00:42:07] Speaker2


[00:42:08] Speaker1

I do have I think obviously, I swear, maybe not, obviously, but as we’re talking, I’m coming up with these these ideas. And I think the thing to remember is and what I would put pressure on myself is, wait, this story is irrelevant because this meaning, whatever story it is, is irrelevant because I don’t know what it connects to. And I think the important realization is you don’t necessarily have to know right now, thus the story bank. And, you know, we mentioned last week where you write it, dude, in a journal. 

[00:42:42] Speaker2

Mm hmm. 

[00:42:42] Speaker1

This can be like I use notion. Or you could do it in there or click up or a Google spreadsheet or whatever it is that you. 

[00:42:50] Speaker2


[00:42:52] Speaker1

As long as you’re using it. You know, you can capture in your phone, voice, message, whatever it might be. That you have this there all your stories and then you can go back to it. And maybe try to make a connection. Yeah. Know, I’m thinking of my my daughter at my desk right here where I’m sitting, and I’m trying to figure out if this is a bad thing for me. In relation to my why. This will make sense in a second. She’ll come in and she’ll come into my office and say, I have to go to work. She’s three and a half. She says, I have to go to work. And so I have a road caster pro for podcasting here. So it’s a fairly big board, if you will. It’s got the sliding things. I don’t really have no idea what they’re called, the sliding things on it for volume. And it’s got, you know, colored buttons that you can press. And I think I’ll do it right now. So there’s crickets and. 

[00:43:49] Speaker2

There’s some. 

[00:43:50] Speaker1

Music and just different sound effects. So she’ll go on here and she’ll just start tapping buttons and everything like that, and the computer is off, but she’ll start banging on the keyboard and stuff like that. And I have an air conditioning unit here in the office and I have this if you’re on video, obviously, if you’re watching on YouTube and putting up this AC remote, this is her phone. So she’ll pick it up and hold it to her ear and she’ll pretend like she’s talking. I don’t know if this is Daddy’s working too much or this is just simply what she sees me doing sometimes, right? So anyway, I think that’s a story that I could put in my story bank and use it at some point to clarify a point, just like you just mentioned.

[00:44:37] Speaker2

Yeah, Maya’s watching me work. What Maya relates work to is what Daddy does. Yeah. So I’ve got to be very intentional on how I show if my why is I want to show Maya that she doesn’t have to work so hard. I got to be very intentional of showing that to Maya today. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. That’s how you tie your way into it every single episode. I’m looking at the story big as we’re talking because we talked about this last time. I think about turbulence. I had shared a story about turbulence. I. Had originally happened in 2019 and for the first time I shared it in 2022. So you never know what where the story is going to come from, what I do in my store, because I’ll often date it because I do want to see like how long is it going to take me to tell or am I ever going to tell this story? Yeah. And so I’m just looking through it. Actually, this was a funny I’ve never shared this story. So this happened last day of 2019, December 31st. It says the title of it. So I title every story so I can easily remember it in case I don’t have the story back in front of me, then I’ll tell the story and then I’ll end it with What’s the lesson that I may think I could use this in? This one is Uber. Driver by day. 

[00:45:52] Speaker2

Music artist by night. And I said, I’m headed to the airport and I called for an Uber. Uber picks me up at 6:30 a.m.. She texted me as soon as I get in the car, you’re okay with me playing R&B music. This was the question that sets everything up. She plays India.Arie. She then tells me she’s an artist. Her song is coming up next. But after the India.Arie song, her song won’t play. And now she’s she’s fidgeting with the phone to try to get it to play. But the song won’t play. This could be planned or not for me to feel sorry for her. It finally plays. We listen and I have a good time talking the rest of the ride. What I found interesting is that she had it already cued up. She knew to ask. She was a great marketer. She knew to ask me, Hey, do you mind if I play R&B music, if I like R&B music? She then she played a very popular artist in R&B, India.Arie. Then she she told me she is an artist and she’s her song is coming up next. And I just thought that was like and that’s why I titled it Uber Driver by Day and Music Artist by Night. It was like she was still hustling. She was still yeah. She was prepared, even though she was probably, you know, good driver and didn’t want to be an Uber driver. 

[00:47:06] Speaker2

She was going to make the most of this. And that was kind of the lesson is can you make the most of every experience? Yeah, smart. Never share that story before, but it’s sitting here in my story bank and it’s a funny story of. Someone who is just music artist, right? Yeah. The story doesn’t always have to be the reason I wanted to share that one, because the story doesn’t always have to be this dramatic. We saw some dramatic. Right. It doesn’t always have to be that. It does. But it it’s just a story. I brought you into a very specific moment in time. I had to go to the airport at 630 in the morning. And even at 630 in the morning, I’m just not thinking about this. Even at 630 in the morning, she’s ready. She’s ready for whoever is going to come in her car, that she is going to let she’s going to play her music for that person. Yeah, right. Like. But that’s the lesson. Are you ready or are you ready for any time that someone is saying, Hey, what do you do? Or, Hey, can you help me with X, Y, Z? Are you ready to show up? I watched a Kanye West documentary, Part two. Last night, as a matter of fact. And there’s a moment in part two if you haven’t watched it, I won’t ruin it. 

[00:48:10] Speaker2

It’s not. I’m not going to. It’s not. Yeah, it’s not anything major, but. He wants to be this rapper. He’s a producer, but he wants to be a rapper. And he gets the opportunity to go into the studio with Jay-Z and they’re trying to figure out this song. But I guess. He comes up with a line or he comes up with. You see him working through the verse with Jay-Z and then he lays down the verse, he lays down the track. But Jay-Z says something at the end that you don’t realize what was happening until Jay-Z said he was like, closed mouth, don’t get fed. If you hadn’t spoken up, you wouldn’t be on this track. And I guess what was happening is that he was there to help Jay-Z produce the song. And then he told Jay-Z, no, I could rap on this. Jay-z is. He gave him a shot. You can rap on it. Let’s do it. Are you ever ready when someone says, let’s go, are you ready? Right. Again, that’s that’s the point of the story bank, though. And that’s what I wanted to show. Before we wrap up today. It’s like the story bank is what helps bring all of this along. If you don’t have it, you can’t withdraw from it, you can’t think about it, you can’t pull it up, but you can make it easier if you do have a story back. 

[00:49:18] Speaker1

So let’s challenge everybody listening right now to, well, what do you want to challenge people with? 

[00:49:25] Speaker2

I want to challenge first to get a journal. It could be any journal. But. But that is your story. Bank and start. I would start with prompting yourself by going through your phone. This is where in 2022, if you have pictures still in your phone from 2021 last year, look through some of those pictures and start to write down the stories of moments in time that have happened. Maybe you were at the park with your child. Maybe you were. I know I have a story in here about standing in line and watching this woman teach her. I think it was four years old. She was teaching him how to pay for what he bought. Hmm. He was a really smart kid because she also taught him taxes like sales tax. Sorry, sales tax. But anyway, go back into your phone. Look at pictures, look at moments in time and tell the story of what happened in that moment in time. The same specificity that Rick showed when he could remember his dad walking to the house with the igloo in his hand. That same specificity. So that’s the first thing. And then you share your stories is the second thing. That’s the second challenge. It’s not just writing them down, but start to share them. That’s how you get better at storytelling. And that’s when you realize what is the story that gets people to lean in? Yeah. 

[00:50:48] Speaker1

And this is a great example of we’re going to wrap up here. This is a great example of people are always saying, I don’t know what to write about or I don’t know. I don’t know what to talk about. I don’t know. I don’t know what to write emails about or if they’re posting on social media or whatever it might be or doing a podcast episode or a video or whatever it is. Like. These are perfect examples that you can pick from. That make it a whole lot easier. And obviously your story bank isn’t going to be overflowing in one day, but it’s committing to doing that, and I’m definitely going to do that. Going forward?

[00:51:26] Speaker2

Yeah, it’s repetition. It’s repetition. We talked about it offline, Rick, but I sent you my book. You’ll see. Inside the package is a notebook. And it’ll make more sense when you get the package. But there’s a notebook that you could literally use that to start your story bank. Yeah. And so so yeah, I storytelling doesn’t have to be hard. I think over the years, marketers and people in general have complicated storytelling. Yeah. A story is a recounting of a very specific moment in time. You can then tie that story strategically into information that you want other people to know about to have. I mentioned it in part one, I’ll mention in part two value to me in 2022 is not information. It is not tactics. Value is the story that you tell. They get someone to remember the information. 

[00:52:23] Speaker1

If this microphone wasn’t attached to this arm, I would drop it right down, man. It was so good. And you were very you were very nice to me today. 

[00:52:34] Speaker2

It wasn’t that bad. It was a great coffee story. It’s just what I like. So I’ll tell you the truth. I literally threw my hands up when you made the transition. So for people that go back and listen to that episode with him and Zach when he does the introduction, I literally throw my hands up. When you you say, I have no idea why I’m telling the story, I’m like, Oh, my gosh, it would have been such a great transition from that point because you literally go right into Zach Yeah, talk about his journey and I’m like, No, there was something there. Like, so from this point on, no more irrelevant story. Oh, more. Rick, we’ll be telling amazing stories to see if I have anything to do with it. Like he it’s yeah. So he. 

[00:53:15] Speaker1

Yeah. And I’m going to have you back on, by the way, and we’ve already talked about this and just to kind of tease what that’s going to be and we’ll have you on and we’ll have you back on in a little while. But you and I talk about this on a lot on the show because I’ve gone through this myself is burnout. And you’ve gone through burnout. You you’ve made a lot of changes to your lifestyle, to how you set up your business, you know, your hours that you work, etc., etc.. And I think that this is something that’s so many of you listening right now we’ll be able to take away as we dove into Jude’s story around that burnout and what that look like and what he does right now, and to help overcome that and to sort of the right way to say to deal with it, because I do the same thing. It’s like, I don’t want to ever do that again. So we’re going to do three, four, three here on the podcast. 

[00:54:11] Speaker2

I’m looking forward to it. Yeah, I hope no one ever gets to the point that I got to where you’re paralyzed. Yeah, yeah. 

[00:54:19] Speaker1

So we’ll break it that all down. Future episode. You’re on the show in the meantime. 

[00:54:24] Speaker2

For the next episode. Yeah. Yeah. 

[00:54:28] Speaker1

Where you mentioned the. 

[00:54:29] Speaker2


[00:54:29] Speaker1

Where can you got a newsletter? Where can people connect with you? 

[00:54:33] Speaker2

Yes. Dramatic Leverage newsletter is where I teach the business side of storytelling. So similar to what I taught Rick today on how to not only tell the story but leverage the story. Dramatic Leverage Newsletter. You can go to Jud Charles, CEO for Slash newsletter. It’s also the best place to get my book. I wrote a book called Dramatic Demonstration. It teaches the art of storytelling and how to bring your story to life specifically. So I have been a documentary filmmaker for the last 16 years, producing documentaries for entrepreneurs, bringing their story to life. But those same principles in visual storytelling. I teach in the book to help you master the art of storytelling and to be able to stand out as the only option for other people to want to work with. The only option for someone to want to buy your product. Dramatic demonstration. And if you go through the newsletter you can you’ll find it through there or on my website. Ju Charles Co It’s on the front page. But yeah, I, it’s, it’s my life’s work. It’s the first book I wrote of many that I will be writing, but it’s my life’s work. Dramatic demonstration. 

[00:55:41] Speaker1

I love it. I’ll link everything up in the show notes for today’s episode. Everybody, Jude, my friends, so good, so good. Thanks for coming back on the show here in part to look forward to having you back on the show again for the burnout conversation. So thank you again, my friend. 

[00:55:59] Speaker2

Awesome. Thank you, Rick.

[00:56:01] Speaker1

Hey, my friend. If you are an established online course creator or you’re an online coach, maybe you have a membership and you’re looking to take things to the next level in your business. You’re already seeing success in the business, but you are tired of working all the hours, right? You’re tired of doing all the things in your business and you know you want to have a bigger impact. You know you want to increase your profit while working fewer hours, right? Without all the hustle, because you don’t need all the hustle in order to have a very, very successful business. Well, if you’re going to be doing those things, but you’re not really sure what next steps to be taking, how to grow your team, how to optimize your sales and marketing your systems and processes, your mindset in your business of what it means to be heading towards a seven figure CEO. Right. Then this is exactly what we help you do inside of my accelerator coaching program. This is one on one coaching group coaching and a mastermind experience all wrapped up into one program. This is a program that I created because this is something that I always wanted early on in my business after I was already seeing success in the business. So if you want to learn more to get our help in helping you grow your online business, accelerator is a 12 month program. It’s. Application only, and we only accept a few people per month. And then we cap it. We cap it at right around 35 people. So if you want to learn more and apply, just go to Rick Mul Radio.com four slash accelerator. Look forward to reviewing your application. And as always my friend, thank you for tuning into the episode to the podcast here today. Super, super. Appreciate you for coming to hang out with me today. Got a ton of great episodes coming your way and a whole lot more storytelling here in the podcast. So until next time, my friend be well. I’ll talk to you soon. 


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